News -> Cover Story

A Fine Mess

20110803-cover-0101Wednesday, August 3, 2011
By Wynce Nolley
Photos by Robin May

Nearing its fourth anniversary monitoring — and busting — lead-footed Lafayette motorists, the SafeLight/SafeSpeed program is racking up millions of dollars in fines. But getting violators to pay is another matter entirely.

Ever since the first speed van started creeping the streets of Lafayette back in 2007, electronic traffic enforcement by Lafayette Consolidated Government’s beleaguered vendor, Redflex Traffic Systems, has sparked its share of controversy. And despite traffic accidents on a steady decline, there remains a small contingent of passive-aggressive drivers who willfully thumb their noses at the program and who owe massive amounts of unpaid fines — bordering on $5.4 million with the various late fees strewn in.

“Mark Henderson, at one time, was the record holder,” says Tony Tramel, LCG traffic and transportation director. “He has no violations in the last 120 days, but still has nearly $13,000 owed. Arthur Barry is the individual record holder with 212 violations but only $9,100 owed. He will go through and he does it intentionally. The other day he was going 65 miles an hour in a 35 mile an hour zone some place. But there is a concern that we have a person like this who is intentionally violating the law and, for whatever reason, feels that he shouldn’t comply with the law that everyone else has [been] requested to do so.”

And what’s keeping these law-abiding drivers from barrelling through camera-equipped intersections like the ones at Ambassador/Congress and Settler’s Trace/Camellia, which have two of the highest rates of citations? For starters, a bad credit score.

According to the ordinance that created the program, “the actions which can be used to enforce the payment of the violation and related fees may consist of but not be limited to immobilization of vehicles (booting), reporting the debt to collection agencies/credit reporting agencies, and/or initiating actions through the small claims court.”

Any vehicle owner who fails to pay his or her citation after 40 days from the date it was mailed is subject to a late payment penalty of 1.5 times the original violation. Fines can then be contested by requesting an administrative adjudication, which is conducted by the adjudication bureau, within the first 30 days after receiving a citation.

But even as marquee violators like Mark Henderson (pictured on the cover letting the cameras know exactly what he thinks of them) and Arthur Barry accrue high-dollar tabs with SafeSpeed/SafeLight, the program is not utilizing booting as a collection tool and has yet to take anyone to small claims court, despite that it is authorized by ordinance to do so. LCG and Redflex split funds collected from the program 50-50, and delinquent account collection is handled by RedFlex. LCG is in discussions about its next steps to ensure violators pay up, but for now, the program is basically relying on violators to pay of their own volition. An honor system, if you will.

20110803-cover-0102“I know there are a number of violators who have a significant amount of violations, and we’re looking at right now some procedures that we can put in place to collect from those people,” says City-Parish Attorney Mike Hebert. “We want to make sure whatever we do is something that we can enforce on a continuing basis, because I can imagine we’re going to have a significant volume of these to start with and we want to have a process in place by which once we get past that initial load we can do fairly efficiently on a regular basis.”

If a person already has bad credit, the threat of further damaging it isn’t going to carry much weight as a punishment for not paying a violation for running a red light or speeding — but booting could keep him fearful of the flash. However, there’s a snag with that, too.

In 2009, Stephanie Ware, a licensed private investigator and one-time employee at KVOL 1330 AM, along with cohort Todd Elliott, also formerly of KVOL, launched a vitriolic campaign against the Redflex program and the Durel administration for supporting it. This reached a crescendo when the duo filed a lawsuit in state district court alleging that the SafeLight/SafeSpeed program was unconstitutional and illegal.

In Stephanie Ware, Et Al vs. Lafayette City-Parish Consolidated Government and Redflex Traffic Systems Inc., a judge found that the city ordinances did not conflict with state law nor a person’s constitutional right to due process.

But there was a caveat: District Judge Glennon Everett noted that because the right to request a hearing exists for 30 days after the initial notice is given, there is no forced collection and no judgment rendered before the ticket receiver is given the chance to contest the civil penalty. When “applying the same rationale” to the booting provision outlined by LCG’s ordinance, Everett ruled that the practice of booting Redflex violators “very well may not meet constitutional requirements of procedural due process.”

Everett concluded that “the LCG notice advises of the civil penalty but fails to provide any notice for the immobilization of the vehicle. Furthermore, the adjudication hearing provisions in the LCG Ordinances do not address ‘booting’ or immobilization of a vehicle — a listed action to enforce the payment of the civil penalty. The right to contest through the administrative adjudication hearing is limited to contesting the imposition of the civil penalty.”

20110803-cover-0103
 Traffic Director Tony Tramel

In other words, Everett says LGC’s notices fail to warn violators that they may be booted.

“From a legal perspective, if that booting issue is resolved favorably to LCG, then booting is an available mechanism according to the ordinance,” says Hebert.

And if highwaymen like those violators at the top of the list (see related sidebar) aren’t swallowing these debts, then who is?

“One of the interesting things about this is that the people who are violating the local laws, violating the traffic laws for your community, are somehow trying to cast themselves as victims,” says Tom Herrmann, a spokesman for Redflex, in a phone interview from his office at Australia-based Redflex’s U.S. headquarters in Arizona. “The victims are not the people who are running red lights; the victims are the people who are injured when those accidents happen. I think that’s why people universally, or a very large majority, favor the traffic cameras. Yes, there’s opposition and, yes, it’s vocal, but most people, when they think about it, think, ‘I’d rather have a safe intersection.’”

“As far as who eats it [the fine], that’s a difficult question to answer in this context. Everybody’s eating it until it’s paid,” adds Hebert. “It’s not like any money is deducted from RedFlex or LCG. It’s just an additional assessment on the violation. That’s part of the current concern, and that’s part of what we hope to change by putting in place an additional collection and enforcement mechanism here locally.

“What goes on now is just one option [reporting to a collection agency] that’s currently available under the ordinance,” Hebert continues. “What we’re looking at now is to expand into some of the other options on the collection of unpaid fines through some other means.”

One of the other options the city-parish attorney is authorized to pursue under the ordinance is to “file suit to enforce collection of unpaid fines and/or related fees and penalties imposed under section 86-181 by lawful means to secure such payments.”

For scofflaws like Barry and Henderson, who owe many thousands of dollars, hauling them to court may be a cost-effective option. But is it worth taxpayer money to go after violators who only owe a few hundred bucks? Likely not.

Hebert adds that LCG’s legal department is reviewing every option it has for how it will handle those who haven’t paid.

“There’s an issue of fairness here that we really want to address,” says Hebert. “This is something that we’re looking at internally, and all the lawyers are looking at [measures] that are in the ordinance and those that we might want to put into the ordinance. I mean we just want to do a top-to-bottom review of this to see what other options we may have to make collections more effective, and we don’t know what will come out the other end of that process.”

But on the other end of this process is the adjudication hearing. And those who request an adjudication, which is conducted by independent contractors, needn’t worry about being sandbagged: An advance hearing is provided during which the images and video of the incident in question are shown to the accused violators to ensure they are aware of what will be presented in the hearing. They are then afforded the option to withdraw, allowing them to pay the fine but avoid the additional $30 adjudication fee. And if they choose to proceed and are found not responsible, no fines or fees are due.

In the progra20110803-cover-0104m’s hey day, the rate of successful appeals was relatively low — about 25 percent. But, as LCG stats show, in the majority of cases the violators withdraw their appeals before moving on to contesting the violation in an adjudication hearing. Those hearings used to be held every Friday; now they’re held just once a month.

LCG has accumulated $5.37 million in fines since the program’s inception. Aside from keeping the “lights on” and paying for the program’s day-to-day upkeep, the money goes into a Traffic Safety Fund, an account created by the City-Parish Council to receive the “revenues” from the program — revenues earmarked for traffic safety-related programs. For the 2010/2011 fiscal year, more than $2.5 million was appropriated for it.

“So you pay the vendor first, who’s doing the services,” explains Tramel, “and then if there are any remaining funds they are to be used for traffic and safety improvements including but not limited to public education, intersection improvements, dedicated police officers, etc.”
He emphasizes that all of the money in the Safety Trust Fund is strictly violator funds; it contains no tax dollars.

Tramel remai20110803-cover-0105ns the program’s biggest booster. “First of all, what we’re trying to say is that a traffic crash is a relatively rare thing and there are many things that cause traffic crashes — driver behavior, different vehicles, weather conditions, different conditions, light, day, night — you name whatever it is, those are relatively rare occasions that take place,” he says. “The most important thing is are we changing the [driving] behavior of people? And that’s a hard thing to measure.”

Dean Tekell, Tramel’s predecessor who now operates his own traffic consulting firm, says that while he’s not a fan of the Redflex program, it has changed his driving behavior. “While the claims of the program’s safety, from what I’ve seen, are somewhat exaggerated,” he says, “overall they’re beneficial.”

Along with changing drivers’ behavior, the program is also funding about 10 significant infrastructure projects, including a $400,000 urban pavement striping program, a $600,000 intersection overhaul at Gloria Switch Road, a $570,000 Johnston Street/Louisiana Avenue/Evangeline Thruway improvement and a $270,000 intersection upgrade at Congress and University. Those are big ticket improvements funded solely by people who choose to break the law yet pay their fines. Imagine what could be done with local government’s portion of the approximately $5.4 million lead-footed violators owe — if LCG can just figure out how to get at it.


Comments (70)add
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written by Yahoo Wahoo , August 03, 2011 - 10:47 am
Anyone who supports these cameras is a communist!
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written by Frigin Cajin , August 03, 2011 - 11:09 am
No matter how you feel about the program, these jerks need to be removed from the streets! How dare they drive this carelessly. Is there nothing that can be done to these dangerous drivers when there is knowledge of their actions? These are sick individuals that should be removed from our roads!
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written by Trammel Sucks , August 03, 2011 - 11:25 am
When are they going to fire that moron? He clearly doesn't have a clue about traffic management and anyone spineless and cowardly enough to support those cameras is clearly a douchewagon. I find it shameful that people in Lafayette aren't outraged by these cameras but then we are surrounded by Republicans, so go figure.
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written by Southsider , August 03, 2011 - 11:49 am
Isn't Mr. Henderson no longer with us?
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written by Frankie , August 03, 2011 - 12:02 pm
This program is a scam, designed to make money for a few well placed local politicians. Read about Redflex at:
www.fireredflex.com
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written by Frankie , August 03, 2011 - 12:18 pm
I have found that the more educated people are about photo enforcement, the less they like it. I would have thought that a newspaper called the Independant would investigate into our local program instead of running infomercials for Redflex. Learn about red light cameras. www.thenewspaper.com & www.camerafraud.com
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written by ragin_cajun , August 03, 2011 - 01:12 pm
"people universally, or a very large majority, favor the traffic cameras. "

Really? Then how come voters consistently vote them out wherever they are given the chance to vote on the issue? Sulphur, for example, voted against implementing traffic cams by a very large margin.
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written by camerahater , August 03, 2011 - 01:21 pm
I have a hard time believing that 5 million dollars were accrued legally. Really do you think that many people actually ran a red light? Sure some are legit, but I would imagine that some of the cameras are not certified or the yellow lights have been shortened. I bet most of these fines were a trap in one way or another. I don't believe that the streets are actually safer with these. In fact after a while once you have accrued so many violations at some point you just quit caring. Especially if you were trapped into the violation. I don't believe in a third party company making money for the government.
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written by Where? , August 03, 2011 - 01:49 pm
Where is Charlie Buckels in the story? Why don't they get a quote from him?
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written by PhotoRadarScam , August 03, 2011 - 02:06 pm
How can it be about safety when the cameras have ENCOURAGED this behavior, and when the program has done nothing to take away their licenses? This is about MONEY, not safety.

"The right to contest through the administrative adjudication hearing is limited to contesting the imposition of the civil penalty.”

So why are they civil tickets instead of regular speeding tickets? Answer: MONEY!
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written by myspeedo , August 03, 2011 - 03:01 pm
Durel said, in sworn testimony, that there are "only four citizens against" the cameras. Durel also said in a televised city council meeting that "if we have to deceive the federal government to get the money, that's ok with me".....
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written by Tina B. , August 03, 2011 - 03:44 pm
I think it is wrong to fine the owner of a car and not the driver. If they don't fine the driver how will the behavier change? I will not vote for Durell are any council member that is for this. That is all I can do. If you want these cameras gone vote against these guys in office
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written by Tina B. , August 03, 2011 - 03:47 pm
If everyone who wants the cameras gone votes against Durel. We will have a real pole.
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written by Frankie , August 03, 2011 - 03:51 pm
“The most important thing is are we changing the [driving] behavior of people? And that’s a hard thing to measure.”

This is one of the biggest misinformations about the program. Drive down Camellia Blvd. Traffic flows at 45 mph. At Settlers Trace everyone slows to 35 mph. Then they promptly return to 45 once past the scamera's. The system is desined to get the out of towners that don't know where the scamera's are. They don't change driver behavior and they don't make the roads safer. They make money for the chosen few.
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written by Wheeloffourtune , August 03, 2011 - 04:13 pm
Violator? Really? is that a word a lawyer would normally use in a "civil" action? Sounds like they are trying to paint these people as criminals. But, if it's simply a civil action, then it's not criminal. But, then again they like to have it both ways - don't they. I would be really offended if my government put my picture out there for the press to paint me as a "criminal". I would be upset with both this paper and the person who gave them my information. And, I see there is no comment from Mr. Henderson or Mr. Barry - did the IND even try? Is this defamation?
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written by what to outsource next , August 03, 2011 - 04:14 pm
Outsourcing the police department's duties. Thats what is going on.

Why don't we outsource the whole dept? Have private dicks do the work cheaper than the cops. Have robots do it!
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written by Wheeloffourtune , August 03, 2011 - 04:25 pm
"violations" "violating the law" "comply with the law" "penalty" "violating local laws" "complying with the law" "penalty" "people who choose to break the law"............Does this sound like a civil matter - or a desperate attempt to paint people as criminals who ARE NOT?
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written by Stephen Donaldson , August 03, 2011 - 04:36 pm
Photo enforcement is about micro managing the law for cash, not stopping dangerous drivers. It doesn't pull over someone who is reckless it just sends a bill.

Most of the "violations" are more techincal than safety related.

It is TIME TO LET THE VOTERS DECIDE THIS! NOT REDFLEX MAFIA (go as the residents of Port Lavaca, TX where REDFLEX FRONT men SUED TO STOP A VOTER INTIATIVE! http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/34/3445.asp)

FIGHT THE SCAM!

Ban the CAMS!

www.motorists.org
www.banthecams.org
www.camerafraud.com
www.bhspi.org
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written by Pizza Pro , August 03, 2011 - 04:49 pm
No problem with me, I drive the speed limit. And I am sober which is a problematic situation for the Ind staff.
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written by tlsosu1962 , August 03, 2011 - 05:06 pm
Drive the speed limit.........don't get a fine. Don't run a red light........don't get a fine. It's pretty simple really, just don't break the law!Booooo Hooooo whinners!
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written by Camera Fraud LA , August 03, 2011 - 05:23 pm
A safe right on red does not deserve a "fine." That's just one example of how this program is NOT about safety. But let's look at someone who is speeding and does deserve a "ticket." Let's make sure that he is ticketed by a real policeman, someone who can testify against him.... not a camera. Let's make sure that he gets his day in a real courtroom. Let's make sure that we preserve our constitutional rights because if we continue to allow private companies to enforce laws, then we will get what we deserve as a country. Please remember that we still live in the greatest country on earth and we'd like to keep it that way.
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written by Camera Fraud LA , August 03, 2011 - 05:45 pm
A safe rolling right on red does not deserve a "fine." That's just one example of why this program is NOT about safety. Someone who is speeding way over the speed limit does deserve a "fine." But let's make sure that the "ticket" is issued by a real policeman who can testify against him. A camera can NOT testify against anyone. Let's make sure that he has his day in a real courtroom. Let's make sure that his rights to due process are preserved in CRIMINAL traffic court with a human witness. Let's not continue to allow a private company to act as law enforcement. Let's not continue to shorten yellow lights to increase revenue. Please remember that we still live in the best country on the planet. However,if we continue to allow our rights to erode we WILL get what we deserve. Then we will ALL be whining. Please don't miss the point.
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written by ragin_cajun , August 03, 2011 - 06:30 pm
"However,if we continue to allow our rights to erode we WILL get what we deserve."

Excellent point! SafeSpeed proponents don't see this as an issue. To them, SafeSpeed is just an innovative way to enforce an existing law--er, newly created civil law in Lafayette's case.

But to opponents of SafeSpeed, this has very little to do with speeding tickets and everything to do with rights/freedom/government intrusion into individual liberty.

The 2 sides see 2 very different things when they debate this.
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written by Question Everything , August 03, 2011 - 06:48 pm
It appears Mark Henderson and the late Joel Henderson had something to say on this very issue a while back: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCosXMdw6Kk
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written by Gerald Bertholl , August 03, 2011 - 07:20 pm
When a program goes in like this one did (and it is not alone) with all the common sense obvious mistakes, like not verifying speed limits PRIOR to implementation, not getting the police dept involved until after it was awarded, not having an accurate crash database to assess before/after, not having the radar FCC licensed, improper notary stamping, etc etc etc. The project created an the atmosphere of a circus and destroyed credibility in anything/anyone connected with it. No wonder people are speeding and not paying tickets.

Funny, prior to implementation i saw a report where about 30% of the 'violators' in other cities didn't pay the fines. Now all of a sudden the legal people are looking at this to see what can be done? Same old 'award a project', then when problems crop up we will try and correct some things after no foresight whatsoever. Again, if an engineering oriented approach were taken these type of things could be avoided at best or minimized at worse.

I wish the citizens would wake up......
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written by Take a deep breath , August 03, 2011 - 07:32 pm
A real live policemen catches you, OK. A machine catches you, not OK? The same law is broken just different enforcement. Is a crime not a crime unless enforced by a real cop?
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written by Camera Fraud LA , August 03, 2011 - 07:48 pm
Thank you ragin_cajun for not being one of the sheeple.
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written by Farrow , August 03, 2011 - 08:37 pm
I've received one traffic ticket in my life, and that was in 1984, right after I first learned to drive. In short, I drive like a grandmaw. Regardless, I strongly oppose traffic cameras because they are operated by a for-profit corporation. Moreover, I oppose the installation of cameras -- could this not very well be the Big Brother of which we were warned?
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written by Frankie , August 03, 2011 - 08:48 pm
Thank you Question Everything. Awesome video.
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written by CowboyStop , August 03, 2011 - 09:19 pm
A rolling stop at a red light IS illegal! In the state of Louisiana you must come to a COMPLETE stop and end ALL FORWARD momentum before proceeding to make a right turn on red, and you are STILL liable to yield. Those of you who roll through right-on-reds are doing the same as someone who runs them straight through. If you get in an accident, such as rear-ended, within a reasonable distance(the officer's discretion) you will be at fault and ticketed with failure to yield. I know of this first hand, i was the car with the green light.
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written by James C. Walker , August 03, 2011 - 09:31 pm
In almost every case, longer yellows and posted speed limits set at the 85th percentile speed of free flowing traffic under good conditions will produce greater safety than shorter yellows and artificially lower posted speed limits. Bad engineering plus cameras is about $$$$$$$, NOT safety. The science is on our website. Perhaps you will join us to try to rid the country of predatory ticket cameras that are ONLY profitable when the engineering is done in ways to reduce safety overall. James C. Walker, National Motorists Association, www.motorists.org, Ann Arbor, MI
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written by Robert G , August 03, 2011 - 10:41 pm
If police officers have to monitor more intersections would the cost be per day, week & month? If we have no monitoring system in place what is the point of a speed limit. Maybe we should tell peope to drive safe, that is, what you think this means. With violent crime being a big issue and other areas needing attention like dui's our PD can be more effective by being allowed the flexibility to be assigned to high priority problems. I for one thing there should be reflex on streets with schools. What could is a speed reduction here if the same mentality to reflex is applied. As long as discretion is used wisely during adjudication much lenience can be given to first offenders and in other cases. A similar problem occurs with snipe signs. Any business owner can put this litter signage on the side of a street for cheap gorilla advertising. But it's irresponsible when you consider what our city would look like if every business owner, etc put signs out. Again. It's litter but no one get prosecuted or fined effectively. But this is gonna change soon. A separate adjudication system an handle all nuisance fines not serious enough for taking up valuable court time. Then when you don't pay you will face charges you can't get around.
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written by The Real Law , August 03, 2011 - 11:30 pm
32:365 (b) - ........
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written by scottman , August 04, 2011 - 12:29 am
Lots of $$$ spread around I would like to see the bottom line if anyone knows it. What % does the city receive and what percentage do Joey's friends at Redflex make.
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written by Southsider , August 04, 2011 - 01:24 am
More of the same whiners and cry-babies. The only difference is the website. Whah whah whah...cry me a river. Hey folks, if you don't like it here, please go find a job somewhere else, get your medical attention somewhere else, shop somewhere else or live somewhere else! Its that easy. It has always amazed me that there are usually more comments for this long dead horse non-issue than the fate of our school system, the out of control drug addicts, the homeless, the economy, etc. About the only thing that gets more attention than the Redflex/Safespeed program is Cherry May's billboard and Doc Stewart.
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written by Gene , August 04, 2011 - 02:39 am
It is clear by most of the post here, that the voters dont want red light cameras. Yet Joey and Tony insist that most residents do want them. Could it be that the majority is lying? Or is it these two guys? Always vote against their good ole boy network,ALWAYS!
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written by negative , August 04, 2011 - 02:39 am
Throw out all the bogus arguments against Redflex. They are written by losers who are not happy with anything and want to take cheap shots.

Durel, Tramel, the council all did the right thing to get a large percentage of the people to drive the way they are supposed to drive. Accidents at intersections are far less than they were prior to this program.

That is the only proof we need that the program works.


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written by Frankie , August 04, 2011 - 11:46 am
There seems to be two kinds of people that support the red light camera's.
1-Folks that are unaware, or in denial, of how the program works and rely on LCG (who is making the money)and the local media for their information.
2-Folks that are profiting from the program, directly or indirectly.
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written by Camera Fraud LA , August 04, 2011 - 01:10 pm
Here is another link you might be interested in...the story and photo regarding Lafayette's Traffic and Transportation Director, Tony Tramel and the radar detector on his dashboard. I guess he doesn't have to obey the speed limit but everyone else does.

http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/23/2306.asp
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written by Tina B. , August 04, 2011 - 01:13 pm
I have spoken to people who love the cameras. They speed through them and pay their fines by mail. They love it. No record, no hassel, and they don't have to change their driving behavior. These people have plenty money and don't mind the fine, but don't want to go to court or have this on their driving record. $100 is not equal from Boudreaux's district to Patin and Bertrand's districts. Raise the fines in river ranch to $100,000 each time and they might not like it any more than the poor people. And if they collect every now and then, Tony and Joey would stop bitching about the people who don't pay.
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written by Question Everything , August 04, 2011 - 02:25 pm
"written by Southsider , August 03, 2011 - 06:49 am
Isn't Mr. Henderson no longer with us?"

His father passed away last year around November, so this story is about his son, Mark. Guess you can't get blood money from a dead man. Shameful the Independent knew about this and tailored the story as such.
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written by negative , August 04, 2011 - 02:56 pm
Ignoring all the idiots who espouse twisted logic on this blog, there are basically 2 ways to try to change bad driving behavior:

Option 1. Hire many, many more police officers and equip them with cars, equipment, etc.. Station them at intersections to chase down people who are breaking the law. Cost? Many millions of dollars each year. Who pays for it? While fines might offset some of the cost, all the taxpayers in Lafayette pay it --- even if the person who breaks the law lives outside of the city.

Option 2. Use cost-effective technology to identify the culprit and fine them. Cost? Technology deployment can be expensive - unless someone else pays for it.

In this case, Redflex pays the entire cost to install these cameras, and it gets a take of the proceeds to make its business viable, the LCG gets a big part of the take and is able to invest those new proceeds to make traffic safety improvements.

No new taxes are needed to fund an initiative that results in safer streets. That is all that counts.

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written by Tax Man , August 04, 2011 - 04:41 pm
Redflex tickets are a tax. Only you didn't get to vote on it. Anytime government takes money from it's citizens - it's a tax.....a rose by any other name......is still a TAX.
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written by Tina B. , August 04, 2011 - 05:06 pm
negative,
You sound like Joey when you make a statment about people who disagree with you as "losers who are not happy with anything" Joey says things like this all the time on his radio show. Are you Joey?
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written by MonicaH , August 04, 2011 - 05:26 pm
Tony Tramel should be removed as fast as these scamers should be removed. You have a constitutional right to face your accuser in court. I can't face a camera in court. Redflex is NOT law enforcement. Pay cops--not Redflex!! It's not about the safety; it's about the cash flow. Stop the cash flow, and the cameras will come down just like they did in L.A. Look it up!!
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written by MonicaH , August 04, 2011 - 05:47 pm
Don't forget to check out our facebook group: "Four Citizens Against Red Light Cameras." Lots of good info and interaction there.
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written by Rinkelstein , August 04, 2011 - 07:19 pm
Tina, when has Joey ever called anyone a loser on the radio?

And for all the Tony haters (and I vehemently oppose the cameras) when was the last time you got stuck in traffic in Lafayette? I get stuck in Baton Rouge half of the time that I go there.
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written by Concerned Non-Speeder , August 04, 2011 - 07:43 pm
Three main points:
1) The comments made about the PENDING legal suit brought on by Stephanie and Todd are incorrect. One would think an editor would have checked these facts, but she may be busy with her own problems these days.
2) How much of the "five million dollars" in fines has gone to profit the state/parish, as does when you pay a ticket issued by an officer? Maybe you haven't noticed, but RedFlex is not an American-based business.
3) A petition was created when this matter first became an issue, a petition that got close to three thousand signatures. So much for four people dissapproving.

Smart speeders do not equal safe drivers.

It would also be nice to not see this paper not consistently on it's knees doing favors for Tony Tramel and Joey Durel.
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written by COPS , August 04, 2011 - 11:01 pm
Take a breath...it is not a crime unless a cop makes that determination. And the police, who are the only ones authorized under state statute to enforce traffic laws, may not use a picture of you speedind and mail you a citation at a later date...32:365(b). So yes - it IS NOT a crime unless a cops makes that determination. Tony Trammel, Joey Durel, Charlie Buckels, and company....ARE NOT COPS. There is no difference with Redflex than your neighbor taking pictures of you and sending you and invoice. Because basically that's what this is. You neightbor spying on you.
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written by Southsider , August 04, 2011 - 11:02 pm
Pasted:
written by Concerned Non-Speeder , August 04, 2011 - 02:43 pm
Three main points:
1) The comments made about the PENDING legal suit brought on by Stephanie and Todd are incorrect. One would think an editor would have checked these facts, but she may be busy with her own problems these days.

Thought that suit was already settled.

2) How much of the "five million dollars" in fines has gone to profit the state/parish, as does when you pay a ticket issued by an officer? Maybe you haven't noticed, but RedFlex is not an American-based business.

Neither is Shell, Michelin, Seiko, BP, Toyota, Honda, Kia, Mercedes Benz, BMW, the list goes on and on....

3) A petition was created when this matter first became an issue, a petition that got close to three thousand signatures. So much for four people dissapproving

Lots of the signatures were collected by KVOL at ther corner of Johnston St. & South College during Mardi Gras 3 years ago. They scammed the general public into a free tshirt giveaway if you signed up for something. Come to find out it was for a petition. How do i know? I was located right next to them. I had to for the majority of the day their banter until the police finally shut them down.

If the majority of the citizens of lafayette dissapproved of the program, everyone would be up in arms. Its the same local yocals that have beaten this dead horse to no end. They must have gotten a new horse from the racino to beat it to death too......


Monica: to stop the cash flow, all you have to do is tell the violators to mind the law. The flow will stop.


Pasted:

written by Frankie , August 04, 2011 - 06:46 am
There seems to be two kinds of people that support the red light camera's.
1-Folks that are unaware, or in denial, of how the program works and rely on LCG (who is making the money)and the local media for their information.

Wrong once again Frankie: same song, different verse.
I full support the program. Not in denial, and don't care how the system works. My daughter has been caught twice. You bet she paid the ticket. Teaching her a lesson on the driving laws. Guess she is a slow learner.

2-Folks that are profiting from the program, directly or indirectly.


...
written by Question Everything , August 04, 2011 - 11:39 pm
I'd suggest to the rest of the well-informed people here to not listen to Southsider. It's quite obvious he's been bought by Trammel & Co. to argue in favor of REDFLAKES. Southsider, if you support them, then you support EXTORTION. Al Capone would be so proud.

Read up on your constitution...specifically with regard to Due Process of Law and Bill of Attainder. Also read up on the Privacy Act and find out how illegal it is for a third party company to profit off of photos taken of you in your car, which is an extension of your home. The red light camera photos are NOT public domain.
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written by Question Everything , August 04, 2011 - 11:41 pm
"Tina, when has Joey ever called anyone a loser on the radio? "

When he appeared with Burnadette Lee on KPEL about two years ago talking about the REDFLAKES issue and those opposing it. Likewise, he made the same faux-pas on KLFY around the same time.
...
written by Question Everything , August 04, 2011 - 11:46 pm
written by Rinkelstein , August 04, 2011 - 02:19 pm
And for all the Tony haters (and I vehemently oppose the cameras) when was the last time you got stuck in traffic in Lafayette?

Answer: Every single day on Johnston St. from around 7:30 am to about 9 am and then again at about 4 pm to about 6 pm, Pinhook at Bendel just about any time the sun is up, Kaliste Saloom at 90 during major traffic hours, Congress St. and Bertrand to Congress St. and University any time there is any major event at the Cajundome/Cajun Field, Ambassador Caffery at the mall, any time of day, Downtown on any weekend night(Friday/Saturday/Sunday), Ambassador Caffery near I-10 any time, University at I-10 anytime, shall I go on?
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written by Southsider , August 05, 2011 - 12:52 am
Question Everything...i suppose you know more than the judge in regards to this issue? i don't need to read anything in regards to it. It has already been exhaustively debated on the TDA site. Your rant is nothing new. Oh, and don't put words in my mouth because i support the program. Perhaps you have recieved your violation in the mail? Sounds like you can't handle the truth...bwhaaaaaaa
...
written by Morrow , August 05, 2011 - 12:54 am
I want to know how much the retired police officers make for reviewing the photos. Who are they employed by? How many of them are there? How many hours and days do they work, or are they full time employees? Do they get salary & benefits and if so, what? I believe their pay comes out of monies collected from the fines, but how is that done?
...
written by Frankie , August 05, 2011 - 11:52 am
The title of this story "A Fine Mess" pretty much summs up the program from day one. Red light camera's in Lafayette have been a disaster since the beginning. They need to go. The local sell out politicians should have their retirement accounts full by now. Why can a chosen few politicians collect tickets from the roads that our tax dollars built?
...
written by Question Everything , August 05, 2011 - 02:38 pm
written by Morrow , August 04, 2011 - 07:54 pm
Do they get salary & benefits and if so, what? I believe their pay comes out of monies collected from the fines, but how is that done?


I'm fairly certain if they were to get paid by LCG it could be construed as some type of payola. However, if they are being paid by REDFLAKES, then there's definitely a conflict of interest. It's a lose-lose either way, which is why we don't know, and they aren't telling.
...
written by snaildarter , August 05, 2011 - 02:57 pm
Look at all you folk raggin' on each other.

The real issue are all the many small questions arising here, such as those asked by Marrow.

The Independent should be answering those questions, not kowtowing to those at the top of the Lafayette pyramid.

It is obvious that the (not very) Independent did someone a favor, maybe someone who can help CFM with her legal driving problem... "...Help us make money by scaring people into paying their fines by publicising our threat to do what we legally or practically cannot do.

And don't tell me that Joey does not call people names and disparage their mental health on the public airwaves. KPEL should be ashamed of it's collective self. I've heard it too many times to not notice. So don't tell me that I didn't hear what I heard. KPEL's archives have been cleansed of Joey being taken to task on his manipulation of the "conversation."
...
written by Richard Carter , August 05, 2011 - 04:43 pm
The loudest voices raised against Redflex come primarily from two sources: speeders and lawyers. Redflex reduces the speeding issue down to a simple question: "Were you speeding or not?" I have unfortunately been tagged by the cameras on multiple occasions. Never was one of them mistaken. Yes, I am becoming more conscious of the need to reduce my speed, mostly because I don't want to hear my wife fuss at me again when she sees the ticket. To those upset by the remote collection of data, do you wish to get rid of forensic evidence entirely--DNA, fingerprints, security cameras, etc? To those concerned about intrusive government, I applaud your vigilance. As soon as you succeed in scaling back the real culprit--our bloated, omnipresent federal boys in Washington--then you can focus on a few cameras serving to free up our local policemen so that they can address more serious crimes.
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written by tlsosu1962 , August 05, 2011 - 07:33 pm
GOOD GREIF! There are more pressing things to complain about!
...
written by Concerned Non-Speeder , August 06, 2011 - 07:37 pm
written by Southsider , August 04, 2011 - 06:02 pm
"Thought that suit was already settled."
You thought wrong, good try, though.

"Neither is Shell, Michelin, Seiko, BP, Toyota, Honda, Kia, Mercedes Benz, BMW, the list goes on and on...."
However, none of those companies are attempting to collect money off of people under the title of "law Enforcement." Not to sound ugly, but this is truly an ignorant statement.

"Lots of the signatures were collected by KVOL at ther corner of Johnston St. & South College during Mardi Gras 3 years ago. They scammed the general public into a free tshirt giveaway if you signed up for something. Come to find out it was for a petition. How do i know? I was located right next to them. I had to for the majority of the day their banter until the police finally shut them down.

If the majority of the citizens of lafayette dissapproved of the program, everyone would be up in arms. Its the same local yocals that have beaten this dead horse to no end. They must have gotten a new horse from the racino to beat it to death too......"
There is no trickery in getting someone to sign a petition. Much as with anything that one signs, it is assumed that the signer has read and consented to it. If they didn't, that is not the fault of the petitioner.

And maybe you didn't notice from all of the previous comments, but there are plenty of people up in arms about this.


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written by Southsider , August 08, 2011 - 03:12 am
Concerned...as i stated many times on TDA, your lame excuses have been used. Try to come up with something new as an excuse for breaking the laws. It has always been a handfull of the same people that are against trying to enforce the laws. Try as you may, the program is hear to stay. I think more of them would be great. To bad you disagree.
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written by Southsider , August 08, 2011 - 03:22 am
Concerned:...did you see my previous post regarding speeding and running red lights? Please, once again, if you don't like it the way things are here, you and everyone like you, please find somewhere else to do business. Really, you won't be missed....
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written by Frankie , August 08, 2011 - 01:42 pm
Please, once again, if you don't like it the way things are here, you and everyone like you, please find somewhere else to do business. Really, you won't be missed....

We were here before the scamera's came here. Maybe you should go back to Australia with your Redflex cronies.
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written by Southsider , August 08, 2011 - 09:32 pm
Frankie...It doesn't matter who was here first. Sorry, your wrong once again. I'm not an Aussie. But i am not sorry for once again supporting a program which deters accidents, and hopefully someone getting hurt or killed. See my above statements once again. If you support breaking the laws and potientally harming an innocent driver, then so be it. Just as you and a handfull of other rantards don't support the program, I am just as zealous in my support over it and will continue to support it until they are done away with. Perhaps your rantards should try to educate the public that if they don't break the laws, then the cashflow will stop, then the camera will come down. Until that happens, long live Redflex.....
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written by Aaron , August 09, 2011 - 12:49 am
I think a good citizen protest, and almost certain death to redflex, would be that on a certain day of each week everyone who doesn't like the redflex cameras drive 10 miles per hour less than the posted speed limit. A five mile trip on a 45 mile per hour road would take an insignificant longer amount of time. Each protestor should have a bumper sticker explaining their actions.

If only 5% of the population participated it would have a surprising domino effect, since the countless drivers behind you must drive the same speed. This protest would therefore drastically reduce the number of redflex tickets given on that day. Let's say it reduced the number of tickets by half that day, which I think is not an unreasonable number (If one driver drives slow he effects the 20 drivers behind him on crowded streets during rush hour).

Now, one day of the week gives redflex about 14% of their total revenue on average. So a 1/2 hit on that day would cost them about 7% of their gross revenue. That may not seem like much, but remember it's 7% of the GROSS. That's a huge hit which would wipe out significantly more of their net revenue from Lafayette, I'll wager more than 50%.

Once they see that they've got a 50% hit on net revenue in Lafayette they could possibly decide to relocate their assets elsewhere.
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written by Jim Letten , August 09, 2011 - 12:50 am
Is investigating!
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written by Square and On the Level , August 09, 2011 - 02:57 am
Walter Pierce, editor:
You've come out in support of SafeSpeed/SafeLight. Let me try to nudge you.

Your writer states that the accused can get an adjudication hearing and "needn't worry about being sandbagged."

The photo above that statement on p.10 clearly shows a speed van not parked exactly parallel to the road, an operational necessity for proper function of the radar unit.

The independent contractors for the adjudication hearing have an extremely limited scope of jurisprudence. They will shrug and commend your argument and evidence, but still find you "responsible."

You are told the next step is appeals court, which requires a $250 filing fee and the likely necessity of hiring a lawyer. Last I checked at the Clerk of Court office, not one lawyer has argued a case before a local appeals court judge.

So, if a lawyer is reading this, fight the damn citation for the rest of us. That would give back to the community a lot better than an annual free hamburger and T-shirt.

C'mon, Walter. Muckraking is honorable. Let's see more of it.
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written by resident , August 10, 2011 - 05:06 am
This is BS. I got a ticket for 6mph over the speed limit. There has to be more of a margin of error for the drivers. Sometimes you speed up a little to get through the yellow light, you know, so the camera doesn't get you for going through a red light..


I REFUSE TO PAY FOR THIS CRAP!
I hope the rest of you will do the same.


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written by Mark Henderson, the guy in the photo , September 22, 2011 - 05:57 am
North Carolina just banned the cameras for being unconstitutional.

Stuff that in your radar detector and speed with it, Trammel.
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